This retail project has a series of fabric awnings that are fairly large. Have you come across fabric awnings that qualify as non-combustible or limited combustible to the extent that sprinkler protection is not required beneath? Looking for guidance to provide to an architect client.
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Do laundries within residential buildings require a standard-spray sprinkler, or can they also use residential-style sprinklers? What about corridors?
Posted anonymously by a member for discussion. Discuss this | Submit a Question | Subscribe Can I determine a room capacity for a classroom or lab by just walking in and measuring the room's square footage and using a load factor?
Some of our classrooms have so many desks it looks like a cattle car going to slaughter. I'd like to be able to go room to room and say, "This is the maximum allowable seats...". Appreciate any simple tips for a simple guy. Thanks. Posted anonymously by a member for discussion. Discuss this | Submit a Question | Subscribe Despite a shorter month we had a record number of comments on the site this past month. Thank you to all those who share your take on the questions posted here. Your collaboration not only helps those who asked the question but the rest of us learn about different approaches to fire protection challenges. Here's the top ten for February 2019:
There's a fully-sprinklered jail renovation that is using 18-foot long (13-foot wide) four-man pre-engineered steel jail cells.
Typically we would use sidewall institutional-style sprinklers which can throw up to 16-feet in length. The goal is typically to conceal the piping behind the cell so that it is inaccessible to those within the cell. Has anyone encountered these longer cells, and if so is there a solution other than putting a sidewall at the front and back of the cell? Posted anonymously by a member for discussion. Discuss this | Submit a Question | Subscribe I ask this only to satisfy my own curious nature.
I've observed sprinkler system pipes that appear to be joined with what appears to be a two piece clamp which is itself joined by nuts and bolts. What is this fitting style and how does this method function? Posted anonymously by a member for discussion. Discuss this | Submit a Question | Subscribe The table in NFPA 13 for different hazard classifications and hose allowances has a range for the water supply duration (table 11.2.3.1.2 in NFPA 13-2016). For instance, Ordinary Hazard has a required water supply duration of "60-90" minutes.
When is the lower part of the range used, and when is the higher used? Posted anonymously by a member for discussion. Discuss this | Submit a Question | Subscribe My clients are wanting to store a small amount of Class IIIB liquid (cooking oil) in a Group S storage mezzanine that is part of a larger Group F-1 commercial cooking facility. I've done the larger FP scheme for when this product becomes a full-scaled production with its own designated processing plant, and that has a rack protection scheme for Intermediate Bulk Container storage.
This smaller-scale renovation is a mock-up of the larger scale production in an existing plant- intended to get product to the customers for test marketing. The quantity stored will be a single pallet of (60) 5 gal plastic jug in box containers. The overhead system is Ordinary Hazard Group 2, although if I source calculated I could probably get a .6 x 3000 +500. Because the quantity is so low, nothing in NFPA 30 seems to really pertain to the storage. The jurisdiction is on the 2012 IFC, and I think that §5704.3.4.4 applies. It basically says that flammable and combustible equipment for maintenance and the operation of equipment in excess of 10 gal shall be stored in liquid storage cabinets (the equipment of course being the searing/frying equipment in the other area of operation). My question arises from never having to have specified protection criteria for storage quantities so small. I want to get the client to unload the pallets into 3- cabinets, following all of the separation criteria. Does use of the cabinets mean that the fire-rating requirements for "control areas" do not need to be followed? Or does the standard want the storage cabinets inside a burn-rated area? If it is the latter, I am planning to ask the fire marshal for an exemption for the 1-hr burn rating required by NFPA 30 Table 9.7.2. Posted anonymously by a member for discussion. Discuss this | Submit a Question | Subscribe For projects where you have to survey and/or trace existing sprinkler systems for modifications, what tools/methods do you use? Just a 25' measuring tape and a ladder? Point and shoot laser? Laser scans?
I generally measure locations of sprinklers and pipe off of walls or structure using a point-and-shoot laser measure and a laser plumb bob so I know I'm right beneath my measurement point. That being said I'm very interested in learning about how other people do takeoffs. Posted anonymously by a member for discussion. Discuss this | Submit a Question | Subscribe Is it allowed, by code, to have multiple buildings served by a single fire department connection?
There's an existing series of about 12 buildings (a campus) that is served by a site fire pump house (most buildings only have sprinkler, a couple have standpipes). On the discharge side of the pump house is a fire department connection. This is the only method to supplement flow and pressure for the fire department. NFPA 13, 14, 20, and 24 would all apply here, as well as the IBC and IFC (2015). Is this permitted by code? Posted anonymously by a member for discussion. Discuss this | Submit a Question | Subscribe I have seen window sprinklers spaced across an entire wall of a building that has windows on the exterior and I have been told it has to do with spreading fire to a building next to it.
I have also seen window sprinklers on the exterior of a building where there is a metal fire staircase next to the building outside of windows. Any insight on either of these scenarios as to why the sprinklers would be necessary? Posted anonymously by a member for discussion. Discuss this | Submit a Question | Subscribe What range of heights are allowed for standpipe hose connections above the landing in a stairwell?
Any advice as to arranging the hose connection (height, orientation, etc.)? Posted anonymously by a member for discussion. Discuss this | Submit a Question | Subscribe There's clear guidance for small bathrooms and closet sprinkler protection under NFPA 13D, 13R, and NFPA 13. Do laundry rooms have any similar provisions that would either omit sprinklers or require them in small laundry rooms?
Posted anonymously by a member for discussion. Discuss this | Submit a Question | Subscribe So the calculation for occupant load for classrooms, etc., uses an occupant load factor that is a net factor.
How do we calculate for additional students occupying corridors outside classrooms while classes are in session? Posted anonymously by a member for discussion. Discuss this | Subscribe Does NFPA 13 limit the friction loss per foot of pipe? What is good practice to follow in calculation process?
Posted anonymously by a member for discussion. Discuss this | Subscribe Is there any benefit to having the backflow preventer on the discharge side of the fire pump? We've seen several RFPs recently that are requiring the backflow to be on the discharge side of the fire pump.
To me it seems as though this arrangement unnecessarily leaves more pipe and mechanical components exposed to the public water supply, but I'd be interested in others' opinions. Posted anonymously by a member for discussion. Discuss this | Subscribe I understand there's a tradition of locating a horn/strobe or other exterior waterflow notification appliance on the exterior of the building, but where is it required and is a location stipulated?
Posted anonymously by a member for discussion. Discuss this | Subscribe In your opinion/experience what is the most appropriate fire sprinkler hazard category for a yoga/fitness studio?
When the studio is mostly an open space for active classes the hazard could be limited to the floor mat pads, while my concern would be potential vertical storage of the usually foam-filled pads. Have you come across this before? Posted anonymously by a member for discussion. Discuss this | Subscribe Are there any requirements pertaining to mixing fire sprinkler k-factors or temperatures in the same room?
We often come across unit heater placement, so at least on the temperatures I suspect that mixing in the same room happens fairly commonly to accommodate heat sources. Posted anonymously by a member for discussion. Discuss this | Subscribe Is there a maximum height that's permitted between the main roof and a suspended ceiling in order to still omit sprinklers above the ceiling?
Posted anonymously by a member for discussion. Discuss this | Subscribe NFPA 24 requires the following: "After installation, rods, nuts, bolts, washers, clamps, and other restraining devices shall be cleaned and thoroughly coated with a bituminous or other acceptable corrosion-retarding material." (NFPA 24 2016/2019 10.6.2.5)
If stainless nuts and bolts are used for the restraining glands in the underground fire main, do they still need to be coated with a bituminous material for protection against corrosion? Posted anonymously by a member for discussion. Discuss this | Subscribe Is there a standard or code basis for when pipe is required to be replaced due to corrosion or loss in the pipe wall thickness?
It's usually to the building owner's benefit to examine or replace portions of pipe that are corroded, or consider full-system replacement when a renovation opportunity occurs. Just curious if there's a standard or code basis that would otherwise force pipe replacement. Posted anonymously by a member for discussion. Discuss this | Subscribe I have a wet sprinkler system fed by a combined standpipe/sprinkler riser by municipal water with a "brand new" fire pump in the basement.
Where should the main drain be installed? The municipal water enters the building and goes through the backflow preventer and then into the fire pump both being located in the fire pump room. After the fire pump, the riser goes to floor #1 and above. On the first floor there is a floor control valve with drain. I explained to property manager that a main drain is required in the fire pump room to test the adequacy of the water supply and drain the system. The installer agreed with me but explained that is was not part of the drawing and he did not install one because he did not get paid for one. The property owner consulted with the engineer of record who said that the main drain is not in the fire code. He also said his plans for the fire pump installation were approved by the Department of Building. He also consulted with other more experienced engineers in his firm and was told that no main drain is required on the fire pump piping or in the pump room, but if I wanted to drain the system or perform a main drain test I could do it from the first floor. Is a main drain in the basement fire pump room required? Posted anonymously by a member for discussion. Discuss this | Subscribe I've heard reference to a requirement for sprinkler protection beneath occupied floor levels. This comes up with building overhangs or parking garages beneath buildings.
Aside from it being a common practice and a good idea, where does this requirement originate in code? Posted anonymously by a member for discussion. Discuss this | Subscribe NFPA 13 has clear requirements which do not encourage pipe to be routed underneath buildings (NFPA 13 2016 Section 10.4.3 / 2019 Section 6.4.3).
As best I can tell NFPA 13R does not have similar provisions, although the reasoning for not routing underneath is the same (pipe can become compromised by building settling, leakage is extremely difficult to repair, leakage could cause significant building damage). Do I have any justification to not allow pipe to be run underneath a building designed under NFPA 13R? The project at hand is an attached block of apartments that has a breezeway in-between, and the contractor is looking to run pipe back underground (below footings and the breezeway sidewalk) to serve the block of apartments on the opposite side. Posted anonymously by a member for discussion. Discuss this | Subscribe |
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